Silk Road forums
Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: DiMiTriSpice on August 10, 2011, 05:24 am
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Hello friends,
I will be posting a number of ayahuasca capsules very soon and wish to emphasize the active constituents and the safety issues regarding the product. First, because this is indeed the most important (I cannot drive it in enough); it is very dangerous to take these pills if you are taking SSRIs (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors), tricyclic or tetracyclic antidepressants, or norepinephrine or dopamine reuptake inhibitors. This is because pharmayahuasca contains harmaline, which is a selective inhibitor of serotonin A. If taken in conjunction with the above antidepressants there is a strong possibility that serotonin syndrome may ensue, characterized by hypertension, hyperthermia, trip comas, and maybe a trip to the hospital.
Here’s my general spiel:
Monoamine oxidase inhibitors (MAOIs) are a class of compounds that deactivate monoamine oxidase (MAO), which are naturally occurring enzymes in your stomach. There are two types of MAOIs: those that inhibit MAO-A and those that inhibit MAO-B. How is this relevant? Monoamine oxidase is what prevents DMT from being orally active. In turn, the addition of an MAOI allows DMT to be activated in the stomach. MAOIs also increase the strength of many tryptamines and phenylethylamines. Please approach this option with caution. There are many natural and pharmaceutical MAOIs available. They are commonly used as antidepressant and antianxiety medication because they increase the availability of serotonin, dopamine, and norepinephrine in the brain. Some are reversible and others are not. This is pertinent because nonreversible MAOIs disable MAO until the body can make more (it takes about 2 weeks). This is not ideal. On the other hand, reversible MAOIs allow MAO to continue its job 24 hours after being taken.
Harmala alkaloids are natural reversible MAO-A inhibitors. MAO-A is responsible for breaking down tyramine in the human body. Tyramine is most commonly absorbed into the body by the foods we eat. However, because taking an MAO-A inhibitor prevents tyramine from being oxidized, a buildup of tyramine can occur. Too much tyramine in your body can cause headaches, elevated blood pressure, and in extreme cases severe hypertension. It is referred to as the "cheese effect" because many people on MAOI regimens have experienced headaches after eating cheese. The most important foods to avoid are cheese (pasteurized cheese such as cream and cottage cheese are ok), preserved meats (sausages, salami, etc) and good beer. Budweiser, Tecate, etc are all ok. Dark beers and draft beers are not recommended. Personally, I have never had a problem with food interactions and harmaline. I drink beer and eat cheese all the time but check it out for yourself. Everyone's body chemistry is different. This is mostly an issue for persons taking MAOIs daily because those who take it only occasionally can break down tyramine when the MAOI wears off. These risks are significantly less serious with harmala alkaloids than other MAOIs due to the fact that harmala is a reversible MAOI.
MAOIs should never be taken orally with antidepressant medication (serotonin, dopamine or norepinephrine inhibitors and tricyclic or tetracyclic antidepressants) or ecstacy. This would result in "serotonin syndrome," which is when the brain is overloaded with serotonin to a dangerous level. It can be life-threatening. Symptoms include facial twitches and fever. Mild serotonin syndrome is often seen when one takes too much ecstasy.
Note also: we have designed this formula by referencing Jonathan Ott's studies, playing with them, and then performing multiple bioassays on ourselves. The experience, which lasts 3-4 hours, provides insight into oneself while simultaneously creating a profound connection with the world. It is not at all overwhelming, but is instead progressive and smooth. Fantastic bright colors, complex patterns and geometric designs. In some ways pharmayahuasca is similar to lsd but richer with a pronounced euphoria. It is truly fantastic, and apart from one instance in which I had mild nausea, there have been no problems. As a veteran of mother aya, I chose to go a different route, and not wanting to scare the pants off of anybody I chose a moderate dose. This product is engineered to introduce the ayahuasca experience, not break through it. That’s why we are going to list in order’s of twos. 8) If you wait half an hour after the first dose and take the second you will certainly experience Xanadu.
Peace, and if you have any questions shoot me a line.
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dont i know it, they put me on ssris a week ago, they arent nice to begin with but they also take away all my much beloved psychedelics, i have been looking at your listings though as my friend assures me that dmt is even better than acid so im very keen to try it, just didnt want to be swigging down some awful tasting mixture, which is the same reason ive steered clear of mescaline from cacti, ill wait until some synth comes about for that
also there are certain foods which can be dangerous when taking an maoi, i cant remember them all off hand but i know mature cheeses were definitely one of them, i think this is a near complete list from wiki
Tyramine occurs widely in plants and animals and is metabolized by the enzyme monoamine oxidase. In foods, it is often produced by the decarboxylation of tyrosine during fermentation or decay. Foods containing considerable amounts of tyramine include meats that are potentially spoiled or pickled, aged, smoked, fermented, or marinated (some fish, poultry, and beef); most pork (except cured ham); chocolate; alcoholic beverages; and fermented foods, such as most cheeses (except ricotta, cottage cheese, cream cheese, neufchatel cheese), sour cream, yogurt, shrimp paste, soy sauce, soy bean condiments, teriyaki sauce, tofu, tempeh, miso soup, sauerkraut; broad (fava) beans, green bean pods, Italian flat (Romano) beans, Chinese (snow) pea pods, avocados, bananas, pineapple, eggplants, figs, red plums, raspberries, peanuts, Brazil nuts, coconuts, processed meat, yeast, and an array of cacti.
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Death or sickness by serotonin syndrome is not very nice at all. Anyone selling MAOI if derived from plants or pharmaceutical should have a big "DO NOT USE IF YOU ARE TAKING SSRI" in their postings. Anyone using any drug for the first time needs to do their research, at a minimum read about it on erowid.org.
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Ok - I just listed a hundred pharmas. If all goes well and if everybody's happy I will list a few hundred more. FYI - guinney pigged the GF an hour ago (for prob the hundreth time, and btw shes having a fantastic experience, hehehe). Just wanted to make sure I blew the mind of all my customers. Peace and love. Be safe.
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out of interest how long should i wait for the ssris to clear my system? i stopped taking the horrible bastards yesterday, would a week be long enough of a wait or should i leave it 2 weeks to be on the safe side? i wasnt on them for more than about a week before coming to the conclusion that i really didnt want to take them anymore so there shouldnt be massive buildup (not that im entirely sure of the half life of citalopram)
although im also liking the sound of that changa, so maybe a bit of both! thank god im due a tax rebate, its all being converted into coins i think! and i want to know the second that psilocybin becomes available, i tried for ages to get an rc supplier to send me some 4-aco-dmt but not one would due to good old blighty turning pihkal and tihkal into the drugs law addendum word for word
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You should wait a week after your off SSRIs before taking pharmayahuasca, though I believe any medical professional (which I am not! Ha!) would advise that you wait two weeks for the drugs to leave your system. There is some discussion regarding this on Rumor Mill here - http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=1698.0. Remember to always be safe, know your body, and do your research.
On the psilocybin - yes soon. However, this is not 4-AcO-DMT (a beloved research chem, ah), but rather naturally derived 4-PO-DMT.
Peace.
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4-AcO-DMT,4-PO-DMT....YUMMY....YAY!!!!!
:D
nomad bloodnath
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This is important info. I wonder how the hell the ancient tribes figured this one out?
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the plants told them
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the plants told them
+1
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CronicPain - Indeed, this is a question. I don't want to push a philosophy on this board (because many people have many different beliefs, and they are all relevant all important and all subjective, ha!), however, I believe in the deep biology of this planet, and I believe it speaks to certain people, especially if they are close to her womb. I have been on many adventures and I see a woman, who I believe is mother to us all - looking on in great sadness and warmth. I'm not a theist now. I don't believe in a god and see the universe as spawned from sublime chaos. But there is a wellspring here, something rich and belonging to us the worlds creatures. I hope and chose to believe that we are more than we see ourselves as, but I'm smart enough to recognize that it is internal not ephemeral.
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What about DMT? Is it safe to take with antidepressants/benzos?
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RedDead - Yes, it is safe. However, I have read a couple papers which suggest that taking certain antidepressants (such as zoloft) will diminish the effects of DMT because it binds to similar receptors. You may simply have to smoke a larger quantity. Hope I answered.
Peace,
DiMiTri
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Does anybody know how many pharmahuasca capsules are generally used for a good religious dose?
Peace,
Some Noob
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Dimitri previously said two should give an Aya experience.
But my own personal side note would suggest that YMMV.
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Can we get a topic like this started and stickied for MAOI's in general? Sorry for the resurrection. But i think its important to bring this to attention espectially due to things like aMT and 2C-T-7.
I'm no medical expert but I would say that on a site that offers access to experimental chemicals we should have some more information regarding interactions with MAOIs, the status of various drugs being MAOI's or being effected by MAOI's.
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Agreed, kilgore. I have seen some scary ignorant posts regarding pharmahuasca. MAOIs are not to be fucked with, especially with the amount of MDMA being taken here.
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I understand Ayahuasca that has not been synthesized can detox a user from addictive drugs & stop the addiction cycle. Does your product retain that quality?
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Dimitri previously said two should give an Aya experience.
But my own personal side note would suggest that YMMV.
Pharmahuasca does contain an MAOI and I don't need an extra one, right?